SBC

I love the article on what is wrong with the SBC here.

Here is the response I wrote that I think was censored by the site…..

This post seems to exemplify the problem more than provide a solution, in my view. Every one of the six points is sufficiently vague that only those “in the know” and the real Southern baptists will know exaclty what is being discussed.

A Calvinist will read 1-5 and think that they should be telling people how homophobic complementarian positions are founded on sound biblical doctrine and that they should now step up and go out there to let people know that the world is coming apart and we need to get past the basics here. And while they are at it, they should not reminiss about the old days where gays were not allowed and women knew they place without asking.

And the non-Calvinist will feel that it is good that we finally will allow the message of love and acceptance be the norm, and for those who do not show the love we will have to discipline them, somehow, to show that their old fashioned and non-biblically based ideas will not have a place in the SBC of the future.

The only group you chose to ourgroup explicitly was the post moderns who you totally presented a characiture that is not even close to what it means to be a post modern.

This is what is wrong with the SBC.

I live in rural Virginia and was a trustee, finance member, occasional lecturer in service etc of a church that existed (as I later learned) because of the constant fear that the Calvinists would come in and try to take over the church. They were so fearful of that, and continue to be, that they hid the actual founding documents from the members so that no one can come in and force a vote on theology.

Add to all of that the Baptist Banner rag that circulates around the state http://www.baptistbanner.org/

And there you have a culture of ingrouping some, while a subversive element of Calvinists intent on trying to take the denomination over and political publications like the Baptist Banner meant to further consolidate the position with the Republicans.

What’s wrong with the SBC? Sheesh. Open your eyes.

Afterward I also added something like the following, though I did not save the exact text I wrote.

….additionally, the SBC has had a rather public and well documented political battle for control of the the denomination over the past several decades. What makes us think that the battles would not continue? Here is a good summary: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Baptist_Convention_conservative_resurgence

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I am just going to write a brief opinion here so you all can see the out of touch people in charge of some of our religions.

There is an old saying that it is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought a fool than open it and remove all doubt.  Well, Al Mohler, the President of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary has opened his mouth again.  This time he pick the practice (and religious practice) of yoga as his target.

His article, gets down to the core issue of him being concerned about yoga style meditation and exercise being taught in our schools and at some churches.  Obviously Dr. Mohler is not exactly an introspective type of person and does not see the benefit of centering himself, listening and quieting his mind and getting in touch with the Holy Spirit.  If he did, he would be able to make the obvious connection that having a quiet mind can lead one to be better in touch with the message that god has for him.

Instead, his puritanical mind focuses on the fact that Jesus does not say that we should practice yoga in the bible therefore we should not do it.

This guy is a nut and we don’t need him and his teachings in our Christianity.

He says:

You know the big question is the one that we get to when we finally ask can yoga be separated from its roots in Hinduism and the answer to that is a steadfast, non-negotiable, clear as can be-no.

Al is a fearful person who needs someone to tell him what to do at all times.  My favorite part of the article is:

So much of Eastern mysticism, so much of yoga, if not the entirety of the entire yoga movement, of the philosophy that is summarized by yoga and similar practices is about emptying the mind. But if Christianity is about anything, it is not about emptying the mind. Just look at the Bible and see how much is about God speaking and his people hearing, about cognitive transfer of God’s revelation to his creatures.

I think this is hilarious.  Al Mohler is the one who teaches that you should not consider anything outside of what it says in the bible.  In other words, Al Mohler is the master of “leave your brain at the door”.  I guess this sorry person has never tried to meditate.

Well, I need to sit down and clear my mind a bit…so I can try and not have so much ill will towards Al who really give Christianity a bad name.

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Dr. Albert Mohler, the head of the Southern Baptist theological seminary recently made a speech addressing one of the key elements in defending the cult status of the SBC.  A transcript and a video is available.

EDIT:  I want to point out that the subject of the SBC being a cult is not something I came up with.  I am just weighing in on the conversation.  Twice in this presentation Dr. Mohler refers to the accusation that they are a cult.

Here is a quote from the speech:

The controversy concerning Bruce Waltke, who even in recent months became a focus of controversy after making a video where he argued that, unless evangelical Christians come to terms with accepting the theory of evolution, we will be reduced to the status of a theological and intellectual cult. The urgency of this question and the demand for an answer comes over against what is pressed upon us with the definition of the assured results of modern science.

In this speech Dr. Mohler is trying to address the question:

Why does the universe look so old if it was actually made about 6,000 years ago?

For those of you who do not know, the Southern Baptist Convention teaches it’s members that the earth was made about 6,000 years ago in one instant by God.  He actually does not get to answering the question until the very end of his presentation.  Instead he takes a very long time to do his adult imitation of one of those timeless traditions of putting your fingers in your ears and talking loudly so that you won’t hear what other people are saying.

Here is a definition of a cult

cult –noun

  1. a particular system of religious worship, esp. with reference to its rites and ceremonies.
  2. an instance of great veneration of a person, ideal, or thing, esp. as manifested by a body of admirers: the physical fitness cult.
  3. the object of such devotion.
  4. a group or sect bound together by veneration of the same thing, person, ideal, etc.
  5. Sociology . a group having a sacred ideology and a set of rites centering around their sacred symbols.
  6. a religion or sect considered to be false, unorthodox, or extremist, with members often living outside of conventional society under the direction of a charismatic leader.
  7. the members of such a religion or sect.
  8. any system for treating human sickness that originated by a person usually claiming to have sole insight into the nature of disease, and that employs methods regarded as unorthodox or unscientific.
I think the primary definition in this case is number 6 since the issue at hand is that the Southern Baptists continue to teach, unequivocally that the only way to believe and the true way to believe is to have God created the universe out of nothing, fully formed, 6,000 years ago along with a history of many many things that obviously happened more than 6,000 years ago (dinosaurs and other fossils, DNA evidence, light from stars billions of light years away in mid-flight).
I am not going to try and convince people who believe in a young earth that the earth is old.  If you want some good reading on this topic go to the biologos website and there will be more than enough there.  Instead, I want to propose that the Southern Baptist Convention is indeed a cult given their leader’s closed stance and unwillingness to consider that the earth is old in the face of irrefutable evidence.  They continue to hold this position even though they have access to all the available information.
I also want to distinguish between the leadership and the church going people.  The people are being misled intentionally by the leadership so there is no problem with them.  It is not their fault.  But the leadership is now a cult because of their refusal to even consider that the earth may be old and recognize that it is most likely very silly at best and downright deceitful at worst, for them to believe that the divine creator is trying to trick us into thinking the universe is young.  That would mean that God is lying, and that would truly be against everything we as a faith believe.
It should also be noted that Al Mohler is required to uphold this belief in order to maintain his employment.  Perhaps he should have to divulge that while he is telling people that the earth is 6,000 years old.

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Between the Times Response

by admin on December 24, 2009

in General, Uncategorized

I posted a response at the Southern Baptist Convention site In Between the Times.  I think it is interesting that their title also points to some lose or ambiguity.  Here is the link to the article and my post in it’s entirety.

Folks,

Whether you call the Scriptures fallible or infallible is irrelevant if you do not understand what the scriptures mean. An incorrect interpretation of an infallible document is still incorrect. The point is to understand the message of the scripture and seek to further improve this understanding. We cannot continue to confuse scriptural infallibility with our inability to understand the message.
We need to learn from history, specifically the history that was taught by our Lord and Christ. He made it very clear that those who codify a law and seek a non-living word and “unity of vision” versus a living word in our world are not up to the standard.
Jesus set the example of debating the meaning of the scriptures and interpreting them for those in the temple. We need to be doing the same thing for people in our age. If we limit the new interpretation to how people dress and what kind of music they listen to then we are shallow.
It is a common mistake for immature leaders to tend to pick people like themselves to follow in their footsteps. Immature leaders use someone who will affirm their views and not challenge their views. This leads to stagnation and lack of progress. Jesus taught against this type of thinking. We are to continue to try to look at his word in new ways in the new communities and try to learn from everyone. We need to approach the kingdom of God as a child would with wonder, and questions and a sense of discovery.

God Bless.

Dave

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